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Necromancer design discussion

What is your opinion on the Necromancer design?

  • Perfect as is

    Votes: 19 22.4%
  • Needs a few minor tweaks

    Votes: 46 54.1%
  • Needs major changes

    Votes: 15 17.6%
  • Scrap it and go back to the drawing board

    Votes: 5 5.9%

  • Total voters
    85

pak man

Ghoul
WFTO Backer
Oct 24, 2012
14
4
80
28
#42
Can you explain why these are, it would help to know why you and others think these things :)
U can just google necromancer and compare the images with WFTO "necromancer"

Or just play DK 1 and see if the creature can fit in the game. It looks weaker than the chickens.

No harsh feelings...
 

Noontide

Designer / Community Manager
Brightrock Games
Dec 8, 2012
2,141
1,776
700
Brighton, UK
#44
U can just google necromancer and compare the images with WFTO "necromancer"

Or just play DK 1 and see if the creature can fit in the game. It looks weaker than the chickens.

No harsh feelings...
No harsh feelings taken I'd just like to understand the position of people who don't feel this is suitable because I personally cannot see it myself :)

I think he's a pretty good fit for a Necromancer, he's got the bone motif going on rather than a tribal one which screams necromancer at me rather than witch doctor. I feel he could do to have a more covering robe though that may look different once he's got an actual model.

I think the question should be rather than does this fit into Dungeon Keeper does it fit into WFTO, It doesn't make sense to think about DK1 when that is an entirely different property. But I do think I could see this fitting into DK.

I think it's the big or at least big looking head that everybody knows from cartoons.
I'd say it's more of a helmet, the amount of skin he's showing off seems to indicate there is indeed a living human... or at least ex human underneath, so the skull helmet has to be a size large enough to fit his head in.
 

vin

Spirit
WFTO Backer
Dec 24, 2012
69
30
130
UK
#45
For his weapon/staff, I picture a gnarled wooden staff, twisted and whatnot, with a skull on top and green flame that lights when casting a spell. Either way, i'm not a fan of the staffs bottom half, don't like how its so curved...

But yeah, as others have said. He seems less like a Mage that has plumbed the depths of dark magic and more like a tribal voodoo priest who cuts heads of chickens and raises his enemies as zombies. Bit more formal/regal costume perhaps? The head and shoulders could work though.
 
Likes: Castigator

Haze

Disciple
Mar 31, 2013
91
17
140
35
Moscow, Russia
#46
Too cartoony: 1) jaw chest armour looks too heavy; 2) head is important, but WHY his spine is not protected? I mean, backbone is nececcary for carrying head at least! So - belly should be shielded by some metal-covered bones.

Again: shouldn't be just ugly/funny, but fearful. Maybe lizardlike (lizard-headed?) necromancer could be better. And the skull in the staff should emit smoke or evil red light. Human skin or some lizard-boned armour nedded for torso (hands, legs, spine) protection.
---
Ghouls and Revenants idea, BTW... Ghouls can be OK, but Revenants should not just lose health, but reduce to skeletons. people love skeletons and they can't be patented. More importantly, experienced skeletons can put on armour and grow some additional bones for protection. I mean - flesh is unstable, so I prefer stable skeleton knights instead of slow zombies/Revenants. Good against firebreathers.

Crypt design looks perfect.

One other suggestion is that the Necromancer should have a bit of progression as it levels up. Low level ones might still be very human and fleshy, though with skin that's very pale. Mid level ones could be like above - less alive, more undead and emaciated. The high level ones who have mastered their craft could remove the shackles of flesh altogether and be completely skeletal.
Agreed.

---
P.S. possible Chunder replacement - https://subterraneangames.com/threads/chunder-design-debate.2739/page-3#post-26788
 
Likes: TheButcher

Rezal

Templar
WFTO Backer
Jan 11, 2013
123
47
230
30
#47
Again: shouldn't be just ugly/funny, but fearful.
I agree,they going with the cute look,like its some facebook game. . .Is the game made for teens? or adults who grew up playing Dk and Dk2. . .The art style leaves me with taste of dungeons and impire.
Just looking at the Necro and Chunder I expect the humor to be casual and cartoony instead of dark.
 

TheButcher

Blood Imp
WFTO Backer
Jan 13, 2013
50
27
10
33
Ireland
#50
Ghouls and Revenants idea, BTW... Ghouls can be OK, but Revenants should not just lose health, but reduce to skeletons. people love skeletons and they can't be patented. More importantly, experienced skeletons can put on armour and grow some additional bones for protection. I mean - flesh is unstable, so I prefer stable skeleton knights instead of slow zombies/Revenants. Good against firebreathers.

Crypt design looks perfect.
+1 Skeletons would be very welcome!! Agreed on the crypt, in fact, all the rooms have looked pretty bad ass so far, along with the other ground tiles etc.
 
Likes: Haze
#51
I remember if it comes to voodoo that in first versions of WFTO concept in old GDD from 2008 (still this document is on Google docs :p ) was-a Voodoo Chamber, where You could make potions, it may attracted Alchemist or Smth like that... so maybe it will be in WFTO?

To get ontopic I see we have another goblin-like creature from Gnarling theme. I like Necromancer's style, but it could be more darker, that we would see that he is half alive, half dead. I don't know now if we have Necromancer would we see a Vampire in WFTO?
 
Jan 7, 2012
446
171
340
23
#52
What do you think about giving him a bullskull as headwear instead, these skulls look fearful, have a hole for soul absorbing and the horns arent so big. (also you dont have to slay a powerful demon to become a necromancer)
 

Sebulon

Disciple
WFTO Backer
Dec 30, 2012
83
23
145
33
Hesse, Germany
#53
I'd say it's more of a helmet, the amount of skin he's showing off seems to indicate there is indeed a living human... or at least ex human underneath, so the skull helmet has to be a size large enough to fit his head in.
I wrote "big or big looking" because it isn't very clear where head ends and helmet begins. So my suggestion is to reduce the size of the helmet. Maybe it's even the whole clothing of him that bugs me. It seems as if everything he wears is two inches thick what really doesn't fit to his naked belly. His armor is either too strong or too weak.
 

Sangromancer

Bafu
WFTO Backer
Feb 3, 2013
189
130
255
Innistrad
#54
To get ontopic I see we have another goblin-like creature from Gnarling theme.
actually according to sim he is half dead human...ish husk :S

I don't know now if we have Necromancer would we see a Vampire in WFTO?
Hmm... I wonder if the necro is the replacement for the blood lord (which in all honesty is what I thought the vamp was going to be).

Edit: Also I find it strange that he wears a bone helmet to hide his face, but is quite comfortably bare chested?
 

Sangromancer

Bafu
WFTO Backer
Feb 3, 2013
189
130
255
Innistrad
#56
Everyone's entitled to their own take on things ^_-- I just feel more in favour of staple, you favour the unique approach.

Though! On an alternate take on this, perhaps more bone armour? Such as a rib cage "breastplate"?
Sir are you a practitioner of the dark arts?

Necro: Why yes I am

Do you find yourself getting the chilled in your crypt? Adventurers and would be heroes keep stabbing you in your vitals all the time?

Necro: Yes, yes all the time.

Well Sir, you sound like you need some bone armour!

Necro: Bone armour?

Yes! Bone armour is a rudimentary covering that offers you minimal protection against both the elements and stabbings.

Necro: Really?

Yes! It also helps to hides your malnourished, decaying body from sight and makes you look much more terrifying. One look at you and the heroes will be sent running!
But that’s not all! Bone armour is also high in calcium, rich in marrow, and will compliment your skull helmet nicely.

Necro: Wow! Where can I get it?

Well that’s the best part, for the low low price of a nearby corpse, it’s easily obtainable. Why not make your own? Nothing quite says dark arts practitioner then a homemade suit of bone armour crafted from deceased enemies (or even friends you don’t have to be picky).

Necro: Great I can’t wait to get started!
badassbones.jpg



bone_armor_by_freshtofu-d50zkm4.jpg
 

Castigator

Gargoyle
WFTO Backer
Dec 30, 2012
433
237
305
Germany
#57
While his skillset is mostly fine, the necromancer's visual design doesn't feel appropriate to me.
I am not complaining about his undead body, though. It makes sense, that he would turn himself into an undead being to prolong his life. What struck me as unfitting is his apparel. The necromancer looks pretty fragile, which makes sense to me and reflects his detachment from the living's affairs, as his main goal is to pursue the dark arts.
But even as he doesn't feel temperature like we do anymore, he could still use the coverage and (limited) protection of a good robe. I am totally fine with the chosen bone theme, but I think, that these bones could need some craftsmanship. He could wear bone talismans or use a carved scapula as a shoulderpad.
Which brings us to his helmet. I agree, that wearing a helmet in battle is a most prudent thing to do, but the white shark's jawbone looks a bit out of place, here.
Finally, the staff. The necromancers main weapon is made of bone, adding to his bone theme and while the upper part of his staff has some elegance, the spinal column looks like it would snap, the moment, he tries to lean on it. The staff could do with a design, that allows it to be used as a last resort of defense, when the necromancers ghouls are defeated.
The concept art struggles to live up to morbid beauty, that is the crypt. In all honesty I congratulate you on the crypt's design. It evokes feelings of the catacombs of Paris and Rome and has a dignified silence to it.
The necromancer should feel at home in these underground tombs. His appearance should make it clear, that he is a scholar and not some kind of savage, who picked up the art of necromancy by chance or mistake.
The problem is, that he could easily be mistaken for the latter, in his current design. The roughly sewn and incomplete robe could use some improvement.
If you want to keep the concept art for low level necromancers and improve it, as he levels up, that would be helping already, but ideally you could add some hints, that he is not a voodoo shaman.
And finally some elaborate jewelry, that is made of bones.
 
Likes: Tenebris

Rezal

Templar
WFTO Backer
Jan 11, 2013
123
47
230
30
#58
yeah and to make their own great style :D
The concept art,has this very similar feeling to,but not in a good way.
But this WFTO not DK3 so it should have its own look and feel.

I guess they try to aim for a wider audience than only the DK-veterans...
I agree that the game should not just be made for DK-veterans,the game should also pull in new players.There is right way and a wrong way to do that,I just feel they leaning to wrong way.
 
Likes: Haze

Fireeye

Augre
WFTO Backer
Dec 30, 2012
1,155
687
515
Ze Germany
#59
U can just google necromancer and compare the images with WFTO "necromancer"

Or just play DK 1 and see if the creature can fit in the game. It looks weaker than the chickens.

No harsh feelings...
I personally think this should be how we do NOT do it. If we already have to opportunity to create a new fantasy universe, we shouldn't make things to generic - otherwise we might just call it Dungeons and Tolkien: Skyrim Nights.
 
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