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[Mechanic] Friendship and Marriage System

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Melvin Li

Dwarven Worker
WFTO Backer
Jan 5, 2013
19
15
20
#1
Hello Guys,

We all love DK because of the creatures in it. For me, I preferred DK1 more than DK2 because the creatures in DK1 really have their distinct characteristics. The creatures in DK1 give me the feelings that they are alive. I remember very clearly that Warlords and Vampires always fight with each other and Horny is always angry and getting bored very easily. It is the Sims like system that makes me love DK1 so much. That's why I believe creating a more complicated eco system for the creatures will create so much fun.

In DK1 and DK2, the only system is happiness. If the creatures were not fed or paid, they get angry. If they were living with the creatures they don't like, they get angry. If they were bored, they get angry. It is not enough.

I believe there should be more interactions between creatures. Like Warlocks should interact with other warlocks to discuss magic or knowledges. And mistress can hang out with Horny to show their lusty characteristics.

The marriage system can also has an important function as well. For example, certain creatures can only be summoned as long as some kinds of creatures are married. An orc can only be summoned if a troll and a mistress gets married maybe?

I believe the creature system in Black and White should be included in WFTO but in a simplified way. I want to see development of the creatures. From a lv1 troll which is like a newborn baby to a lv10 troll king which has lots of friends that would always heal him first in battles and maybe a troll wife to make out with after a great battle.After all it is the details that make us so obsessed with DK1 or DK2.
 

ShadowTiger

Skarg
WFTO Founder
Dec 10, 2011
223
101
375
New York
#3
All of this depends on which direction the game takes. If it's more Warcraft 3 than the Sims, none of this would be possible. I would personally love a more interactive game where your dungeon itself has a ton of depth and character and feeling to it, but it appears to be a strategy management game, rather than a Dungeon Simulation.

When Dungeoneer comes out, I look forward to seeing what can be done with it. I'll be right there with you in developing a system like that. :-/
 

Fireeye

Augre
WFTO Backer
Dec 30, 2012
1,155
687
515
Ze Germany
#6
I agree with the others - a complete marriage and relationship system would simply not fit with the theme of the game - you are pretty much an incarnation of evil, after all, not a marriage counselor. Don't get me wrong - I find the idea of a married troll couple amusing ("Sometimes two Trolls fall in love and people wonder what they see in each other"), but this game will very likely have a strong focus on RTS, where this simulation-heavy element would merely annoy the players.
 
Likes: Sacred

Inlaa

Priestess
Jan 11, 2012
426
134
215
27
Texas
#7
Um - I... Um.

Um.

More interactions - Yes, please. Marriage - what.

I'm sorry, but I don't see how adding MARRIAGE would add to the game. I really don't. Even if we were playing benevolent demigods of evil-smiting and not evil demigods of conquest, we'd still be playing a game focused around BUILDING A DUNGEON AND KILLING THE OTHER TEAM. Really, that's what it comes down to. Where does marriage come into this?

If this was a 4X strategy game or an RPG, I could see marriage playing an important role. But you're suggesting that we have minions marry each other for the sake of adding more interaction? Brother, there are a hundred other ways we could easily add more interaction to the game without having to see a troll gurgle out a drunken "I do" to a succubus or some manner of... of... of whatever is like that.

So, there's my thought. I normally don't give flat answers, but this is pretty much a flat "No" to me. If y'want more interaction, I'll agree with you, but I'm not voting for marriage between my minions.
 

Saint

Blood Imp
Dec 28, 2012
48
12
5
31
#8
Well, love blossoms in the most weirdest of places,a dungeon ain't that weird, no? :D
But to be honest... "I don't" as in "no".

As ppl said - yes for depth and so on, but there are other ways to add to it then adding shrek.. Emm i mean marriage.
 

Tommonius

Necromancer
WFTO Backer
Dec 15, 2012
616
247
400
30
Wolverhampton
#9
Sorry I do not like the idea as you present as I fell it owuld not fir the games theme BUT the idea of say monsters naturally grouping together due to a natural kinship I owuld like as we always had the ability to make groups and the barracks was notriously unreliable but I liked the group mode in DK2 where I could make groups easily in possession mode BUT that requires a certain level of micro management and to be honest I like the idea of having patrols built of a diverse warband of creatures like a spellcaster plus a tanky creature and a few strong damage dealers.

I suppose this could be accomplished with them improving on the barracks so I can chuck the monsters in and they bond and group up but I got no idea if they even want the barracks in the game.
 
Jun 27, 2012
349
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#10
It might be neat to have a basic relation system in the game, but not going as far as marriage. Just to have an easy way to see what creatures think of another so you wont be surprised by it. This relation could not be mutual.

the different relations could be:

-Friend.
Mutual respect between two creatures, they wont fight each other and will help each other if one is attack by another creature in your dungeon.

-Enemy.
Hatred between two creatures, they will fight each other when sharing the same lair or workspace.

-Annoyed.
A stage before enemy, a creature is annoyed by another and might show it in small ways. This does not have to be mutual either. A grumpy creature might find a happy fairy very annoying, but the fairy would not find the grumpy creature annoying, to give an example.

-Master/minion.
Creatures might look up to another, and desperatly try to please them and gain their favor. As such the more powerfull creatures could gain minions who protect them and attack their enemies. In some cases it could evolve into friendship.

-Neutral.
Nothing special about this, creatures dont have anything in favor or against each other in this situation. It would pretty much be the standard state of affairs.

This system would not be too imposing, and it wouldnt need to affect anything during battle with enemies. At least not the states itself, but states could change during battle. Creatures could develop a friendship when fighting together after all. Or might get annoyed by a creature that steals loot, kills or otherwise isnt a teamplayer in battle.

I really think that these states could add a lot, and might add more appeal to certain creatures. A succubus could be likely to have a minion around to protect her, entranced by her charms. Certain creatures could be more prone to this than others. Mages would be aware of it and wouldnt fall for it, but various warrior creatures with less intelligence would be an easy prey and would make a great minion to protect the more vurnerable succubus from harm.

The amount of minions could depend on the creature. A succubus could have only one perhaps, while a black knight could have several due to being a natural leader.
Most creatures could most easily develop friendships with their own kind or even start out as friends with any of their kind. But there could also be creatures that see their own kin as rivals.

All such things add flavour to the dungeon and personality to the creatures without pushing it too far. This way you might feel more attachement to the creatures.
 

Enjou

Ember Demon
WFTO Backer
Jan 10, 2012
1,315
785
545
35
#12
Considering that this mechanic involves creatures having long-term investments with one another and we have a level-based game I don't see it working well. Any effort you make to get creatures together goes down the toilet once you're done with the level or skirmish or what have you.

Now, what I could see working is more than just the "dislike" relationships that certain creatures have with other types. Some creatures could be happier around certain other kinds of creatures. For instance, the presence of Succubi would likely make most intelligent male creatures rather more happy - after all, a little eye candy is nice to have in a dark, dank dungeon. They might even fight harder in the presence of one in order to try to impress her. On the other hand, if a Succubi passes through an area it might distract creatures who are working.
 
Jun 27, 2012
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#13
the states I described shouldnt require much long term investments, they could happen quite quickly.
 

AvatarIII

Huntress
WFTO Founder
Apr 20, 2012
1,713
759
570
33
Worthing, West Sussex
#14
the only way I can see this working without being to annoying or complicated is if the creatures automatically had certain relationships,as default as soon as they walked into the dungeon.

for example, all gnarlings are best friends, all male creatures love succubi, all cultists hate beasts etc.
 

RyanAvx

Disciple
Nov 6, 2012
65
47
140
29
#15
Yes! A wonderful suggestion indeed! I can see the blushing cultist bride striding to my dungeon heart to wed their lovely Augre husband, then going on a honey moon to the scenic and sunny Slave Pits, where upon they skip happily around the unfortunate heroes that are being chained and tortured within. Finally, they get closer and yield little Cultgres that will aid me in my conquest of the Overworld!
 

Robofish

Necromancer
WFTO Founder
Dec 1, 2012
507
262
415
29
Surrey, laughing at how rubbish Sussex is.
#16
It might be neat to have a basic relation system in the game, but not going as far as marriage. Just to have an easy way to see what creatures think of another so you wont be surprised by it. This relation could not be mutual.

the different relations could be:

-Friend.
Mutual respect between two creatures, they wont fight each other and will help each other if one is attack by another creature in your dungeon.

-Enemy.
Hatred between two creatures, they will fight each other when sharing the same lair or workspace.

-Annoyed.
A stage before enemy, a creature is annoyed by another and might show it in small ways. This does not have to be mutual either. A grumpy creature might find a happy fairy very annoying, but the fairy would not find the grumpy creature annoying, to give an example.

-Master/minion.
Creatures might look up to another, and desperatly try to please them and gain their favor. As such the more powerfull creatures could gain minions who protect them and attack their enemies. In some cases it could evolve into friendship.

-Neutral.
Nothing special about this, creatures dont have anything in favor or against each other in this situation. It would pretty much be the standard state of affairs.

This system would not be too imposing, and it wouldnt need to affect anything during battle with enemies. At least not the states itself, but states could change during battle. Creatures could develop a friendship when fighting together after all. Or might get annoyed by a creature that steals loot, kills or otherwise isnt a teamplayer in battle.

I really think that these states could add a lot, and might add more appeal to certain creatures. A succubus could be likely to have a minion around to protect her, entranced by her charms. Certain creatures could be more prone to this than others. Mages would be aware of it and wouldnt fall for it, but various warrior creatures with less intelligence would be an easy prey and would make a great minion to protect the more vurnerable succubus from harm.

The amount of minions could depend on the creature. A succubus could have only one perhaps, while a black knight could have several due to being a natural leader.
Most creatures could most easily develop friendships with their own kind or even start out as friends with any of their kind. But there could also be creatures that see their own kin as rivals.

All such things add flavour to the dungeon and personality to the creatures without pushing it too far. This way you might feel more attachement to the creatures.
Given how many creatures you are likely to be handling at any one time, such a system would either get confusing, or be kept to a point where it barely affects the game. I think any relationships should just be based on creature type rather than individualistic minions for this reason.
 
Likes: Lord of Riva
Jun 27, 2012
349
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#17
Erhm, in dungeon keeper you would usually have between 20-30 creatures at most. A good number that they really shouldnt be pushing further.

Seems quite simple to me to manage all that.
 
Jun 27, 2012
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#19
And if theres a simple system that shows it when you select a creature, like relations it has with each other character displayed above their heads, its suddenly equally manageable as two creatures.

For example you select a goblin, and an icon pops up above the heads of all other creatures. open hand for a friend, closed fist for an enemy, crown for a master, whip for a minion, angry smiley for annoying creatures, and no icon for neutral creatures. The displayed relations would be from that goblin's point of view. To see what others think of the goblin, you'd have to select them.

No progress bars for relations or anything, its either a certain state or it isnt.
 

Eek

Dryad
WFTO Founder
Oct 22, 2012
370
209
395
32
Canterbury, Kent
www.leeketh.com
#20
Downvote for relations from me...

Managing 435 relationships is *far* too much...
I dislike Sims, mainly because I'm crap at it so it infuriates me, but don't you concentrate on just one household? so you're only managing relationships with a few people, and the few people they talk to - you can pretend others just don't exist... and I still don't find the time to make everyone stay friends AND keep their life together...

in WFTO, you're gonna have tons more people, and can't ignore *any* of them... and I don't see how you'll actually have time to play WFTO... It'd just be Sims Dungeon where you die really regularly because you're too busy concentrating on making everyone happy than actually training them to be bloodthirsty murderers?

Also, I'm completely opposed to my minions being friends. They're evil. They shouldn't care about each other - they should care about killing, and who can help them kill more people - but secretly plot about how to kill their allies afterwards.
 
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