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[Neutral Creature] Phoenix

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Nov 10, 2011
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#1
Name Phoenix

Stats:

Health: Very Low
Attack: High
Armour: Low
Accuracy: High
Agility: Above Average
Speed: Above Average
Luck: High
Recovery Rate: High
Intelligence: Above Average
Construction: Crap
Training Rate: Below Average
Training Cost: Very High
Wage: High
Gender: Neutral

Skills:
Level 1: Melee [Flaming peck]
Level 2: Heal
Level 3: Fireball
Level 5: Meteor
Level 7: Fire Burst [shoots out three Fireballs: one straight forward and two others left and right in a 10 degree angle; 6 seconds cooldown]
Level 9: Fire Blast [shoots out a large Meteor which does twice as much damage as Meteor; 10 seconds cooldown]
Levle 10: Word of Power

Special Ability: Resurrection

When the Phoenix gets killed (or knocked out), it will burn to ashes and leave behind a Phoenix Egg. The Phoenix Egg will start at 25% health, and has the same max health (and other stats) as the Phoenix had before it died. The Phoenix Egg will gradually restore health at a rate of 5% per second (meaning it takes at least 15 seconds to resurrect, under perfect circumstances). It can still be attacked by enemy units as normal, and if it reaches 0% health, it will be destroyed, or if the enemy has Imprison activated, it will leave behind the Phoenix's body for capture. If the Egg reaches 100% health, it will transform back into the Phoenix with full health, at no other penalty. After resurrection, it cannot resurrect again until it has been out of combat for 1 minute; if it is defeated before then, it will be killed or knocked out as usual.

Also has flight ability and is immune to lava.

Information: The phoenix is a mythical bird, associated with fire and also known for its life cycle, where after a 500 to 1000 year long life-cycle, it will be reduced to ash and bring forth a new phoenix or phoenix egg. Often, in games, this ability is adapted into a resurrection ability; this is no exception.

As for its appearance in WftO, it is basically a powerful offensive caster in addition to having the ability to resurrect itself. What balances this out is a very low health stat, meaning that if a powerful unit such as a Bile Demon taps it a couple times, it's already forced to resurrect, and unless there's something around to draw all attention away from it, the resurrection will fail. It is recommended for any keeper to keep their phoenixes safe at any time because they could die very quickly otherwise. On the other hand, their offensive supporting capability is not to be underestimated.

Behavior in Dungeon: The Phoenix, if under a Keeper's control, typically researches in the Library. It does not do anything special, but it will sleep in the Lair more than usual. It will also prefer to sleep first if its health is anywhere below 100%, to ensure that its health is full at most times.

Battle Style: At level 3 or higher, it will stay at the back and support. Below level 3, it will be forced to go into melee, where it can also do quite a bit of damage. Beware, though, as putting a phoenix up close is very risky.

Jobs: Research, but can do anything else except manufacture.

Obtainable By: Neutral, typically neutral hostile

Hates: Nothing in particular

Loves: Fire; by extension most fire-based creatures and creatures who primarily use fire.

Anger reaction: Typically tries to leave dungeon or turns to Neutral Hostile, attacking other creatures

Lair: A circle of fire. When the Phoenix is not sleeping, the flames will be very tame and barely reach above the carpet. If the Phoenix is sleeping, the fire will light up to the Phoenix' height, while the Phoenix is sleeping in typical bird resting position.

Appearance: Basically a flaming bird. Wingspan of approximately the width of a basic corridor.



The Phoenix egg looks like this:



How Introduced: Appears in some level as a Neutral Hostile, preferably a fiery level with a lot of lava.

Attracted by: N/A; neutral

Torture: The phoenix is stuffed into a giant bucket of water (inside the table) and held down. (Lots of steam comes out of the water bucket)
 
Nov 15, 2011
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#2
i do not like the idea of a phoenix in the dungeon!!!

the phoenix is kind of like a unicorn and therefore not brutal enough... the phoenix fitted well in fairyland with heroes of might and magic!

however, it does not belong in the underworld!
 
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#4
its very simple... the unicorn is not brutal enough and the fire bird or fire fly or whatever the hell it is... is not brutal enough either...

i have to say, you have loads of good ideas tho... i bet if you take all that creativity of your! then you will be able to come up with something more savage and brutal!

thumbs up for your creativity tho... i liked it :)
 

MeinCookie

Dwarven Worker
Nov 15, 2011
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#6
Neither do Werewolves strictly speaking belong in the Underworld.

Also let us be clear while we are here. A bird is made of flesh, bones, organs, air sacs and a lot of blood. It has a beak, a gizzard and it has feathers. This has none of those things - it is made of fire. It is not a bird. If it was a traditional Phoenix than yes, it would have no place whatsoever being underground - but it isn't. Rather than being a bird, this is a magical/elemental construct and thus can be where-ever the hell it pleases. I wouldn't be surprised if that was the one place where there is copious amounts of lava.

As a man who is made of clay is no longer a mammal, a phoenix composed of fire is no longer avian ;) .

Additionally, not every creature has to be brutal. An example? The Warlock. If the key defining characteristic of every creature on the evil and hostile neutral side is that they are brutal than there will be no diversity and every creature will be a boring cardboard cut-out without defining features.
 
Nov 10, 2011
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#7
its very simple... the unicorn is not brutal enough and the fire bird or fire fly or whatever the hell it is... is not brutal enough either...
So, the Phoenix is not brutal enough, because it's comparable to the unicorn, because it's not brutal enough because it's comparable to the unicorn, because it's not brutal enough, because it's comparable to the unicorn, because it's not brutal enough, because it's comparable to the unicorn, because it's not brutal enough ...

Neat logic. Perfectly circular.
 

Evi

Witch Doctor
WFTO Backer
Nov 14, 2011
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#8
So, the Phoenix is not brutal enough, because it's comparable to the unicorn, because it's not brutal enough because it's comparable to the unicorn, because it's not brutal enough, because it's comparable to the unicorn, because it's not brutal enough, because it's comparable to the unicorn, because it's not brutal enough ...

Neat logic. Perfectly circular.
Because this:

http://images2.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20100424042237/overlord/images/thumb/8/83/Bloody_unicorn.jpg/551px-Bloody_unicorn.jpg Isn't brutal, a Unicorn that drinks blood and kills things by impaling them on it's horn.

But that's getting off subject, as this is about a "Fire Elemental" creature, just like what MienCookie said.
It's not a bird anymore if it's all fire.
 
Nov 15, 2011
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#9
its a bird man... thats why i dont like it... even tho its made of hot hot fiiiire!

stop hating!!! :D

i never said that all creatures need to be brutal... you pulled that one out of your own snapper!

i just suggested that the firebird is not brutal enough and yes... i compared it to the fruity unicorn! sooooo fucking what ? :D BIIIG BIIIG DEAL!!!

dont be so uptight here.. lets have a laugh or a cookie or something... hehe...

its just one humble mans opinion! there is no logic in what i wrote... i just wrote what i felt like writing.. so stop hating... :p
 
Nov 10, 2011
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#10
its a bird man... thats why i dont like it... even tho its made of hot hot fiiiire!
You know, it would help if you actually said that, rather than saying something else entirely.

You started the 'hating'. With the "i do not like the idea of a phoenix in the dungeon TRIPLE EXCLAMATION MARK" and all.

i never said that all creatures need to be brutal... you pulled that one out of your own snapper!
Uh, yes you did. You said it's "not brutal enough" for the underworld. So clearly there has to be some standard of brutality. A standard which is higher than a flaming bird setting people on fire.

i just suggested that the firebird is not brutal enough
So you say creatures need to be brutal, since this one isn't brutal enough.

and yes... i compared it to the fruity unicorn! sooooo fucking what ? :D BIIIG BIIIG DEAL!!!
So, the point is you're comparing it to something obviously intended negative (hell, even in this quote the "fruity" gives that away) - a bad comparison if I may add - to criticize the suggestion. Big deal enough for me to reply.

dont be so uptight here.. lets have a laugh or a cookie or something... hehe...
I'm not the one trying to uphold some kind of brutality standard for suggestion creatures to hold up to.

its just one humble mans opinion! there is no logic in what i wrote... i just wrote what i felt like writing.. so stop hating... :p
Well, at least you're posting truth here.
 
Nov 15, 2011
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#11
shit... you actually quoted all these things just to point out that i am the one hating ?

listen.. i just dont like this whole phoenix idea... thats basicly all im saying!

now, im sorry if i have offended you, sure as hell did not intend too...
 
Nov 14, 2011
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#12
For what it's worth, I like this. A fire bird seems to fit in a place where there is lots of fire/lava. And it's definitely not "fruity".
Frankly, I don't see how this is even comparable to a unicorn.
 
#14
I certainly think a creature of fire has a place in a dungeon, and the lack of 'brutality' from a phoenix is not really a fair argument. Something doesn't have to be innately or stereotypically brutal to be brutal, as it can acquire such tendencies. Furthermore, I agree with the argument that being brutal shouldn't be a requirement in the first place.

The problem I see with a phoenix (and other birds) is that it generally flies. The ability of flight could be a great advantage, though it requires wings. Wings would require some room to extend their wings, flap them and navigate around, especially in combat. Phoenices are generally too large to fly around in caverns comfortably.

If the phoenix was small enough it would work, of course, much like it works for bats. What may appeal to me more, though, is a creature that has most characteristics of a phoenix, (egg, immortality, fire, whatever,) without being a bird.. creature that looks/acts nearly exactly like a bird, but without necessarily resorting to making it a simple Fire Elemental. I could be some bird hybrid thing that just.. doesn't fly, as it has adapted to subterranean environment. Or it could be a phoenix creature which has neglected its wings and has over time evolved other means to make use of its abilities, making as much use of its wings as penguins or turkeys are wont to.

... lava penguins. Now there's a thought.
 
#16
@Roald: I am not trying to dispute your right of opinion, but what creature it is doesn't necessarily have to determine whether it's evil or not, does it? Regardless, it could be corrupted somehow. Also, I think something can be said for making stereotypically good/neutral creatures change sides, and giving it an interesting justification.
 

MeinCookie

Dwarven Worker
Nov 15, 2011
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#17
Again it is a neutral, not a minion of the Keepers. It doesn't necessarily have to be evil, it just has to be caught in the middle of things :eek: . That can be a 'bonus' neutral, hostile neutral or anything in between.

Hostile neutrals are neutrals for a great many reasons :) . They may be too lacking in intelligence to be recruited by either side, they may be fiercely independent, they may be so utterly violent they simply cannot be controlled, they may not care for either side's cause for ideological reasons, they may have reasons in their culture or they may be too innately dangerous to co-exist with others.

Bonus neutrals are just extra units which flock to your cause if you find them which generally means they have to be compatible with both sides, or at least feasible to amongst them.

If all neutrals are evil, end-of-story, then its a big surprise they aren't working for the Keeper in the first place rather than skulking around aimlessly in the middle-of-nowhere amongst subterranean wilds just waiting to have their face kicked in by every wannabe Keeper and thick-skulled Hero who happens to blunder by :rolleyes: . Just as if the defining characteristic of minions was 'brutality' things would be preeeetty dull, if the single defining characteristic of neutrals was 'evilness' things would be dull and nonsensical :confused: .
 

Jared

Blood Imp
Nov 23, 2011
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#18
I'm gonna come right out and say it birds are supremely lame cuntish creatures all they do is flutter about making all kinds of irritating and annoying noises the odd crazy fucking magpie swoops down and tries to pierce the back of your skull and drink the sweet sweet brain juice or your eye juice!!! and shit on everything their fragile by design (fucking piss weak creatures!) ( I see you got that with the low health ;) ) goddamit i hate birds in all their forms!!!

The phoenix traditionally had colorful plumage and a tail of gold and scarlet in some legends the whole bird was gold or had green blue plumage now the only fire ability it had was at the end of it's life it built itself a nest of twigs that then ignited and both nest and bird burned fiercely and were reduced to ashes, from which a new, young phoenix or phoenix egg arises, reborn anew to live again so the myth goes it's reborn through flame thing is it never had any fire abilities no fire balls or setting people on fire this is a common misconception.;)

You have to stick to the lore of things you have a nice idea here but I wouldn't call it a phoenix call it something else, that's why I suggested on Spartan878's werewolf idea he rather call it a Darkfur or something else, reason being if I suggested Jedi Knights used machine guns and had a blood rage ability it wouldn't be Canon! and I would be considered a retard..... not that I'm calling you a retard anyway my point is you have to stick to the lore of things.

here's another example alot of the zombie movies nowadays are freaking bullshit if they sprint and run fast their not zombies people!!! Those are more like ghouls man Hollywood always gets it wrong. Zombies are braindead undead they have greater strength then the average human but are slow as shit.:confused:

Sorry I got a little carried away & off topic a bit lol :oops::oops: Anyway I'm against the idea of a Phoenix in this game that's my opinion.
 
Nov 10, 2011
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#19
<snip>

You have to stick to the lore of things you have a nice idea here but I wouldn't call it a phoenix call it something else, that's why I suggested on Spartan878's werewolf idea he rather call it a Darkfur or something else, reason being if I suggested Jedi Knights used machine guns and had a blood rage ability it wouldn't be Canon! and I would be considered a retard..... not that I'm calling you a retard anyway my point is you have to stick to the lore of things.

here's another example alot of the zombie movies nowadays are freaking bullshit if they sprint and run fast their not zombies people!!! Those are more like ghouls man Hollywood always gets it wrong. Zombies are braindead undead they have greater strength then the average human but are slow as shit.:confused:
Tell that to DK's small, green trolls, purple orcs, puny-wings bipedal dragons and what have you. It's not a bad idea to break clichés, quite the opposite in fact. Otherwise we'd end up with a widely unoriginal, uninteresting cast of creatures. DK series has always been famous for its unique take on classic monsters, and we're going to continue that in this game.
 
#20
Again it is a neutral, not a minion of the Keepers. It doesn't necessarily have to be evil, it just has to be caught in the middle of things :eek: . That can be a 'bonus' neutral, hostile neutral or anything in between.
I'm sorry, I didn't realise it was strictly intended to be a faction-independent creature. I thought you could still have good, neutral, and evil phoenices, depending on who they side with (alignment based on their actions), that may even differ in appearance.

And Jared, it's perfectly fine to think outside the box, outside of stereotype, especially when it comes to fantasy games. Innovation is a good thing. Think about it; all the standards you hold now, at some point broke what was commonly accepted. I'm sure the phoenix was inspired by some other fantasy we are no longer aware of, just like the zombie.
 
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